Disturbia, fiction, family, friends, and everything else between the lions.
Published on February 9, 2010 By Tova7 In Current Events

THAT NIGHT…I went home and did a little research. 

I researched the school and district policies on “threats.”

Not surprisingly, there wasn’t anything about threatening the President of the U.S.  However, there were some criteria for what constituted a viable “threat” made by a student while on campus.  This situation did not meet any of that criteria.  Not a single iota.  In fact, the policy goes out of its way to say words have to be weighed with intent, opportunity, etc.  (Like one kid threatening another at school, there is opportunity maybe or maybe not intent (administrative discretion is used here)…there was checklist and this situation didn’t merit a single item.

We talked with our son, who once again assured us this was crazy because NO ONE THREATENED THE PRESIDENT, and asked him if he knew it was a felony to threaten the president.  (Sex, peer pressure, drugs, accountability, and all the things teens deal with these days….somehow or another not threatening the president of the US wasn’t in our top ten primary concerns….especially since H doesn’t have the habit of ever threatening ANYONE…why would we think his first one would be toward the president?)

H reminded us about the movie that came out a few years ago showing George Bush being assassinated.  He reminded us we had this conversation then..that it was a felony to threaten the president.  So yeah, we covered it…so could we please not do it again? haha

My husband called the police officer that night and had him email the report to us…it says essentially that there was an accusation the threat was made, but his investigation shows only he said, she said, with everyone either pointing fingers or saying it didn’t happen at all. 

We chalked it up to middle school drama, administrative incompetency and go on.

 

THE NEXT DAY….

I was in the grocery store when my cell phone rang.

VP:  “Ms Tova, this is Mr A from the middle school.  I wanted to call and tell you the Secret Service will be here within the hour to speak with Hunter.”

Me:  “You have GOT to be kidding me?"

VP: ~righteous~ “No I am not.”

Me:  “I can’t be there within the hour.”

VP:  “If you can’t be here, myself or another could sit in as H’s representative, in your place.”

Me:  ~laughs~ “Isn’t that above your pay grade?”

Silence.

Me:  “If you’re calling to ask….I do NOT give permission for the Secret Service to speak to my child without myself or my husband present.  Are we clear?”

VP:  “Yes.”

I hung up.  Called my husband.  He went to the school and sat in on the meeting.  He said the SS agent seemed annoyed at the waste of time, but he was professional anyway.  The SS agent never asked H if he threatened the president, instead he asked things like…do you own a gun, ever shot a gun, ever killed anything?  (Even though the original statement said there was a threat made involving the president and a grenade.)

(As a side note…my oldest is a pacifist in everything…. but especially doesn’t hunt…thank goodness these questions weren’t directed toward my 6 year old…who LOVES to hunt and skin his own game. hahaha  No access to grenades tho…sorry..)

Now here is where it gets interesting.

Though the boys were pretty much vindicated through the interview process (no one threatened the president)….their names are now on a list kept by the Dept. of Homeland Security.

They didn’t go to trial.  Weren’t convicted of anything, were essentially exonerated in the end of even making the threat, the “incident” is still on record. 

The SS agent told my husband there is no statue of limitation on the list, and YES it could effect any future security clearance my son might wish to obtain for employment purposes.  As well as any area in which Homeland security is involved.  And God forbid if someone ever makes another bad joke involving the president in his vicinity….and really how likely is that with teenage boys?  They’re all so wise and circumspect in their speech.

So essentially if I LIE and say I heard YOU threaten the President, and then I call the cops or Homeland security, EVEN IF YOU PROVE I’M LYING…the incident is recorded.  Your name is on a list to be flagged in the future for anything that has to do with security, passports, etc.  Since this list doesn’t fall under criminal/civil law…its just a “list” and therefore “no due process is required.”  (And in some states, like Ohio, by law, the “incident” has to be given to the attorney general…(ya know in case he/she decides there is a case here after all and wants to prosecute it).

How ludicrous is that?

Now imagine if someone does this to one of your kids?  And that someone is supposed to be a child advocate, someone who is in a profession dedicated to educating and shaping children?

Does it seem reasonable that the VP’s choices, every step of the way, were made in ways that could produce the most harm to the kids involved?

It’s been two weeks, and I’m still flabbergasted by it all.

 


Comments (Page 2)
2 Pages1 2 
on Feb 11, 2010

I didn't mean forced as in coerced. I meant it in the sense that it would be just a political necessity to secure votes. Political parties have to present themselves in such a way that they appeal to the majority of potential voters after all. If a new far right party were syphoning voters from the traditional Republican voter base, the Republicans would have to react to that or risk the Democrats having an easy victory. So appealing to more centrist democrats would be an good method to secure a new voter base. Nobody would force anyone per se though. The way I see it, Democrats and Republicans aren't really that radically different from each other anyway. Those democrats who are dissappointed with Obama would maybe go for a more centrist republican political programm. The way it is now in the US, you can't really chose between different political programs (other than the general distinction of conservative and liberal), just between different candidates. But they are bound to their party in the end, aren't they, so it isn't really a choice of general political direction, but rather a choice of character.

Thinking like that is more common in Germany where parties have to look for coalition partneres all the time and where voters also vote smaller parties to make certain coalitions a high possibility or to prevent other constellations. Angela Merkel was able to stay in power because many people were po'ed by the social democrats and voted the small libertarian conservative party FDP instead, securing a majority of FDP+CDU.

Well, maybe I am on one of those lists myself, because I tried to enter the US without a visa once. It was a misunderstanding and for 200$ I was able to purchase a visa waiver in the end, but yep.. it was fun meeting the immigration and naturalization people at the airport. The lady was like a stereotype of a tough no nonsense bulldog - stout and small, with a really short haircut.  It happened in Bangor, Maine, of all places too. But maybe not, because I had been to the US afterwards and nothing happened, but you never know.



on Feb 11, 2010

utemia
I didn't mean forced as in coerced. I meant it in the sense that it would be just a political necessity to secure votes. Political parties have to present themselves in such a way that they appeal to the majority of potential voters after all. If a new far right party were syphoning voters from the traditional Republican voter base, the Republicans would have to react to that or risk the Democrats having an easy victory. So appealing to more centrist democrats would be an good method to secure a new voter base. Nobody would force anyone per se though. The way I see it, Democrats and Republicans aren't really that radically different from each other anyway. Those democrats who are dissappointed with Obama would maybe go for a more centrist republican political programm. The way it is now in the US, you can't really chose between different political programs (other than the general distinction of conservative and liberal), just between different candidates. But they are bound to their party in the end, aren't they, so it isn't really a choice of general political direction, but rather a choice of character.

Very dead on analysis!  And very close to the truth. I dare say most americans would love more choices, but the end result would not necessarily be different.

 

utemia
Well, maybe I am on one of those lists myself, because I tried to enter the US without a visa once. It was a misunderstanding and for 200$ I was able to purchase a visa waiver in the end, but yep.. it was fun meeting the immigration and naturalization people at the airport. The lady was like a stereotype of a tough no nonsense bulldog - stout and small, with a really short haircut.  It happened in Bangor, Maine, of all places too. But maybe not, because I had been to the US afterwards and nothing happened, but you never know.

I dare say I am probably on a list as well.  But I don't think you will see any reprecussions about it unless one of 2 things occur.  1 - You do something else that brings you to their attention (then they will dredge up anything they can find to justify pigeon holing you) - or -

2. You run for political office.

on Feb 11, 2010

Well, maybe I am on one of those lists myself, because I tried to enter the US without a visa once. It was a misunderstanding and for 200$ I was able to purchase a visa waiver in the end, but yep.. it was fun meeting the immigration and naturalization people at the airport. The lady was like a stereotype of a tough no nonsense bulldog - stout and small, with a really short haircut. It happened in Bangor, Maine, of all places too. But maybe not, because I had been to the US afterwards and nothing happened, but you never know.

haha...Don't feel bad, when we moved to Alaska, during one part of our trip we entered Canada and then came back into the US....our SUV was FULL because we had to pack everything we planned to live on for 4 weeks....until our household items arrived.

Canadian border patrol asked us what we were carrying...told them household goods, and that we'd only be in the country a few hours....when we reached the American border patrol...they asked us the same type questions then made us unload. every. single. item. from our SUV.  They told us later it was just a quota they had to meet...but it literally took us hours to refold, replace, and reload our vehicle after the search.

We were carrying a couple guns (antiques we didn't trust the movers with) and since they were in the luggage it was no big deal in the US, but we er, went into Canada with them, and that's a big no-no.  But, we had spent days packing and I certainly didn't remember everything we packed....the US border patrol thought it was pretty sad the Canadians didn't catch that...

We were relieved.  The guns have been in my husband's family for several generations and losing them to the Canadians woulda killed him.

 

on Feb 11, 2010

Border patrol people are a strange bunch all over the world. You have to have a certain character trait in you to find joy in going through other peoples stuff. Sometimes it comes close to harrassment if you asked me. Of course, they also catch drug and money smugglers - but your story is typical for all border controll people I've met. Traffic in Europe is without border controlls since a few years though, thank goodness for that.

Soooo  you committed a felony? lol Gun running reddnecks who plan to assassinate the president  

on Feb 11, 2010

You have to have a certain character trait in you to find joy in going through other peoples stuff.

I don't know...the US prison system is full of people that enjoy going through other peoples belongings. Just imagine how many haven't been caught yet.

on Feb 11, 2010

hmm Maybe you should contract the border guard job out to professional thieves and conmen lol as a way to work off their sentence and it would save the taxpayer some money. Don't they say it takes one to know one? Hah those customs people I met at the border to Slovenia and Austria certainly were some part criminals.

on Feb 11, 2010

A propos - the EU parliament stopped the US from using european bank data from SWIFT. You guys (CIA) were simply accessing private european banking data (names, accounts, amounts) without any legal grounds. Well, apparently it could create a diplomatic hiccup because this data was analyzed in regards to terroristic financial trails and apparently the data had been quite successful in finding terror cells and stopping attacks. But the liberals and socialists in the EU parliament thought that it was sort of illegal to which the US responded by threatening bilateral negotiations with Belgium (the new SWIFT server was moved from Virginia to Belgium) and circumventing the EU alltogether. The parliament said that they want several conditions met like an interdiction of passing on data to a 3rd party, a time limit on how long data can be stored, a right of EU citizens to take legal measures against the use of their data. New negotiations will likely commence in 10 days. Imagine the US government just accessing US banking data like that without a warrant or cause, just on general principle. Well, maybe they do and you just don't know it.

on Feb 11, 2010

OMG

on Feb 12, 2010

First:  Hi, Tex!  Good to see ya.

Next:  Ruthie, please use some other abbreviation for the Secret Service...it confuses us history buffs.

Tova:  We share a distrust for the admin and teachers in our schools.  I thought that when the littlies got all grown up we wouldn't have to worry about it anymore...then the grandkids started going to school.  Argh!  We have had many run-ins with school peoples over the years and most of them were not good.

As for the threat/non-threat issue, you have already pointed out that there is a criteria that defines what a threat is and Bozo the Administrator obviously thought he was smart enough to go through life without reading the instructions.  We all know how that works out...re:  Christmas Eve at 2:00 am?  Sue his a** into a cardboard box behind Walmart. 

As for the Secret Service...they have a hard job to do and for the most part they do it well.  They don't have the luxury of ignoring any threat that may come to their attention...the old "connecting the dots" thing.  It seems a little ham-fisted at times, but my focus would be on the teachers and VP who took this up the chain.  They are the problem here. 

An heavy equipment operator that worked on a job with me last year used the "N" word in connection with an expressed opinion of our new President.  He received an on-site interview from the boys in the gray suits.  There was no threat involved at all, just an opinion of qualification.

Finally, Middle-of-the-Road Republicans lose elections:  McCain.  Truly conservative Republicans win elections:  Reagan.  Coalitions sound good on paper, but in this country when some one says "Bi-Partisan" that translates to "Do it my way".  The definition of compromise is: Nobody gets what they want.

on Feb 12, 2010

Next: Ruthie, please use some other abbreviation for the Secret Service...it confuses us history buffs.

I know, right?  But it seems to have some scary correlations.  Granted the organization may not directly be comparable, but if someone can invoke our SS to frighten children/teens...well....?

I really wish the agent wasn't such a professional.  He shoulda told the VP to get a pair and do his damn job....instead of calling in the feds to handle a couple 12-14 year olds.

An heavy equipment operator that worked on a job with me last year used the "N" word in connection with an expressed opinion of our new President. He received an on-site interview from the boys in the gray suits. There was no threat involved at all, just an opinion of qualification.

That is scary BFD.  So has it begun?  Is the once transitional political correctness now so terra firma we only have one way to go?  Sacrificing little bits of our freedom along the way?

Sad.

 

on Feb 15, 2010

Oh my gosh Tova.  I just got back from Maine/NH or I would have written sooner!  I can just imagine what you went thru with this.  Right now we are in the middle of something involving the Chief of Police and our church back home that is nothing more than a vendetta. Our elders and Assoc Pastor were arrested!!!  All very Godly men.   The lawyers are all over this calling it a "slam dunk"  Call me and I'll give you details...way way too much to write here. 

My dad was just saying about this that anyone can make a "claim" and you can be arrested or questioned making your life miserable.  There's nothing stopping anyone from doing this. 

When David was in middle school, he drew a picture of the Titanic with a bomb on it after the teacher asked them to draw a picture of how the Titanic may have gone down. 

Well that caused a stir with the teacher and she called me.  She basically said she was "supposed" to go to the principal to report this (using a bomb in a picture is a no-no) even though he drew it with crayon! 

She said she knew he had good parents and that we would "take care of this."  I said "take care of what?  What did he do wrong?" 

Well I guess drawing a picture of a bomb is all it takes to unsettle people nowadays.  I wanted to laugh but she was so serious it didn't seem appropriate.

Our world has certainly gone crazy. 

I remember how to spell "principal" instead of  "principle" because my own principal long ago told us that a principal was a "pal." 

I guess those were the good ol' days. 

 

 

 

on Feb 15, 2010

I remember how to spell "principal" instead of "principle" because my own principal long ago told us that a principal was a "pal."

I guess those were the good ol' days.

That's really too bad, ya know?  Kids today need as many adults on their side as they can get..

I will try and give ya a buzz sometime this week...right now I'm swamped and I know we'll need time to gab.

on Feb 18, 2010

I just read this little story on CNN - can I just say that I am really glad not to have kids in american schools.. no wonder many consider homeschooling a better alternative.

A 12 year old girl was arrested and handcuffed for doodling on her desk. While I don't think that it should go without somesort of punishment like staying behind and helping the janitor or something like that, scaring the beejezus into a little prepuscent girl like that is the true crime. She was treated like a hardcore criminal offender.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/02/18/new.york.doodle.arrest/index.html?hpt=C1

on Feb 18, 2010

"At schools across the country, police are being asked to step in. In November, a food fight at a middle school in Chicago, Illinois, resulted in the arrests of 25 children, some as young as 11, according to the Chicago Police Department."

Thanks for the link Ut..the above quote is taken from it....

Sad.  I'm not sure what we're paying principals for anymore.  They don't want to work with kids, they don't want to discipline kids, seems like all they want to do is take kudos when the school performs well, and blame others when it doesn't.

 

 

on Feb 18, 2010

I am just completely dumbfounded by this and can only say "Ditto to TW".

That VP's behavior was criminal, not your kid's.  Much as I (mostly) hate lawyers, you should sue the livin' shit out of that guy for what this could do to your son's future.

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